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M-Audo Revolution 7.1 Feedback Thread, Part Deux!


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#41 a2daj

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Posted 09 March 2003 - 05:05 PM

Have you tried making sure all the plugs are in all the way?

#42 JonLech

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Posted 10 March 2003 - 01:58 AM

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Will DTS ever be available through VLC?

I added DTS S/PDIF support during the weekend. It will be included in the soon to be released VLC 0.5.2.

#43 Momonari kun

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Posted 10 March 2003 - 03:49 AM

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Will DTS ever be available through VLC?

I added DTS S/PDIF support during the weekend. It will be included in the soon to be released VLC 0.5.2.

Great news! One other question, though. I don't have an M-Audio card yet (so I'm not using any kind of passthrough, so I don't know if this issue affects that), but have been playing with VLC a lot, and it seems to me like the sound quality leaves a lot to be desired. Everything rings a lot in the high end, making the dialogue sound really poorly compressed. This happens on DVD, XviD, SVCD, VCD, any material.

I'm using the standard analog out to speakers. Apple DVD Player doesn't exhibit the same problem (playing only DVDs, of course), nor does mPlayer (command line and GUI). Do you know what is going on?

Edit: Another question. Is there a way to use external subtitle files (.sub .srt) with VLC? I'm really interested in playing them with XviDs, SVCDs, and DVDs. What about positioning of them?

Sorry about the hijack.

#44 Irish

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Posted 10 March 2003 - 05:32 AM

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5. Surround sound and gaming on Mac.

This isn't a response, but a note. Warcraft III's "Miles Positional Audio" generates Pro Logic  (or Pro Logic 2...not sure) audio. Turn on CSII's "Cinema Mode" in the Revolution CP and you can decode this to get positional audio out of Warcraft III. It sounds really good! Please drop me a line if you're aware of any other games supporting Miles positional audio...

I tried this over the weekend. I have a 5.1 Speaker combo with Decoder from Cambride Soundworks (DT3500 Digital), so I did what you suggested above and turned on  the CSII Cinema Mode. At first I thought it sounded really good, and then, when the in-game dialogue began it was almost non-existant. I played the same sequence over and over again (the interlude in the Orc campaign depicting the destruciton of the human buildings) with various settings in CSII and also on my decoder, but nothing I did made the dialogue sound any better. It was just a low rumble and the speech was completely inaudible.  I c hose this sequence because it  has a good mix of sound effects and main character dialogue. The only way I could get the dialogue back to normal was to turn off the CSII stuff completely. It stil sounds pretty good anyway, so I am not too upset about t his. Just curious about why it doesn't work for me when you say it sounds really good for you.

#45 Irish

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Posted 10 March 2003 - 05:56 AM

jasonivan

I think I have answered by own question. After making the above post I went back to playing around with the settings and I discovered that, after chosing "revolution digital out" in the Sound Preferences Control Panel and then opening the m-audio control application, and enabling CSII Cinema Mode etc, after closing the m-audio application, I decided to open the sound preferences again and I discovered they had been reset to analogue out. I chose digital out again, and without doing anything else I launched WC III and played the same sequence. It worked perfectly! And sounded very good indeed. The problem seems to be that opening the m-audio application resets the system default sound output to analogue for some reason. So, in order  to get WC III to work using the Dolby Pro Logic II signal the sequence for me seems to be:

Open m-audio app and enable CSII Cinema Mode
Close m-audio  app
Open sound prefs and choose digital out
Enable digital in via coax and Pro-Logic decoding on my decoder
Start WC III

All is well!

Is this switching to analogue after opening the m-audio aplication a bug?

#46 Greg Grant

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Posted 10 March 2003 - 05:11 PM

Hey Irish

On a side note, I spoke with a prominent source on Mac game programming whom didn't think much of the Miles Audio system and implied that the Dolby Prologic sound output doesn't work on the Mac really.
the IMG audio guy...

#47 Lucian

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Posted 10 March 2003 - 09:04 PM

Greg, Brad Oliver doesn't have a Revolution (at least to my knowledge), so I'm not sure how qualified he is to comment on it.  Also, his comments may have been misinterpreted so I'd like to hear from him first hand.

VLC player 0.5.2 final has been released.  I'll check it out and report back later.

Edit: I just noticed that the Mac OS X version was the only version up.  Not even the Win32 or Linux builds had been posted.  =)  Anyway, the preferences bug seems to be fixed.  There is still only one option (8-channel) for analog output.  The bugs with DVD playback still persist (spoken audio track is very faint).  I don't have a way to test digital output and Dolby Digital/DTS at the moment.
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#48 Irish

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Posted 11 March 2003 - 03:05 AM

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Hey Irish

On a side note, I spoke with a prominent source on Mac game programming whom didn't think much of the Miles Audio system and implied that the Dolby Prologic sound output doesn't work on the Mac really.

I don't know how well it is is supposed to work (I have nothing to compare it with), but when I did get it going it seemed to work fine. All the speakers are producing acceptable output and they are definitely not mirroring each other. There are distinct sound effects comming from left, right, back left, and back right speakers and the main dialogue comes prominently and clearly from the centre speaker. The bass is a little subdued, but it is still more than acceptable in my  opinion. Up until the Revolution I had no way to get 5.1 sound at all out of my speaker system in X (except through VLC), now I have, at least for some games, and WC III seems to work quite well. It might well not be working "properly" but is is all we got at the moment, and it is certainly better than nothing.

#49 Bigc

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Posted 11 March 2003 - 10:48 PM

The more I listen to the M-audio card feeding Klipsch 5.1 system the more I like it. Playing MP3 only each of the speakers has a unique sound as compared to the Klipsch-only with built-in sound. Still a few quirks in the software related to volume settings when opening up the preference windows, but all in all it was worth it. If it only worked with QIII.

#50 Irish

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Posted 12 March 2003 - 04:49 AM

Tried the new VLC (0.5.2  final) last night. Seems to be very stable and sounds great. However, it also seems to have introduced a bug that I had not had since one of the earlier versions of the softwre. The problem is, that after opening VLC and playing a DVD, on quitting the application my system sound is gone. The only way I can re-establish sound from the Revolution is to reboot the Mac. This did not happen with the two  test versions I tried last week. Is VLC failing to "let go of audio control" after it is been quit?

#51 JonLech

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Posted 12 March 2003 - 06:59 AM

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The problem is, that after opening VLC and playing a DVD, on quitting the application my system sound is gone.
Were you using "Digital A/52"? Could you try switching to "Stereo PCM" before quitting VLC?

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This did not happen with the two test versions I tried last week.

The VLC MacOS X audio output module did not change from -test1 to -final.

#52 Irish

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Posted 12 March 2003 - 04:55 PM

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The problem is, that after opening VLC and playing a DVD, on quitting the application my system sound is gone.

Were you using "Digital A/52"? Could you try switching to "Stereo PCM" before quitting VLC?

OK. I tried opening VLC, playing a DVD (using Digital A/52) and quitting three times, and on each occasion, after quitting the application, my sound had reverted to comming from the Mac's internal speaker and not my 5.1 speaker system. I checked the System Prefs Sound Panel and it was still showing as Revolution Digital Out as the output choice. A reboot was all that would bring the Revolution back on line. I then did what you suggested above and switched to Digital Stereo PCM before quitting VLC. This time, although there was no sound at all coming from the DVD playback, when I quit VLC my speaker system worked as it should.

So, to recap: Insert DVD, play a few bits of video using Digital A/52, change sound  to Digital Stereo PCM (resulting in no sound at all), quit VLC, everyting working as it should before I launched VLC in the first place. This is very strange, is it not?

#53 brown monk

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Posted 13 March 2003 - 01:38 AM

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Doh.  I switched between my old Soundsticks, built-in audio and Revo and now I can't switch the main sound output device to the Revo.  I can select it, but all I get is sound coming from the built-in speaker.  Alert sounds still seem to play in via the Revo, but nothing else does.  I can use the speaker test in the control panel and that works too.

The only problem seems to be switching the output device back.  It thinks the Revo is the built-in sound...

I'm having a similar problem.  After updating to the newest drivers I got no sound what so ever.  When I reinstalled the old drivers (the ones that came with the card) I was able to get sound again.

A couple of problems still remain:  the volume controls on the keyboard do not apply to the Revo (after selecting the Revo for all sound in the Sys Prefs); I have to reselect the Revo as the sound output after every restart; Sound dies below the lower third of the sound bar.

If I could get some help with these issues, it would be greatly appreciated.  Specially why the new drivers don't work.  I noticed that the newest version of the drivers are dated 3/4/03...anyway, thanks in advance.

#54 Lucian

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Posted 13 March 2003 - 02:25 AM

brown monk,

You should definitely be using the 1.2.4 drivers.  To get around the sound issues, try opening a movie in VLC player, then go to the audio menu and switch to whichever outputs you are using (digital or analog).  That's worked for me at least.
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#55 Irish

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Posted 14 March 2003 - 05:26 PM

Any more thoughts on the latest VLC anyone? Or any other Revolution 7.1 thoughts? Please lets try and keep this alive. This is a terrific new product and we need to get behind it as much as possible.

As someone else said else where on this site "tactical bumpage".

#56 Sneaky

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Posted 14 March 2003 - 09:43 PM

It has been posted that the Revolution will support positional audio for games that use the Miles sound library, but I haven't read any posts of people actually doing this with MoH:AA (but have for WC3).  Two questions for the forum:

1.  Has anyone gotten positional audio working in MoH:AA with the Revolution?
2.  Does positional audio with the Revolution require a 4.1 or 5.1 speaker system?  (there seemed to be post indicating an issue with 4.1 systems)

If the answer to the first question is yes, and the answer to the second is a set of 641s is capable of producing great positional audio with the Revolution, I'll be very, very happy.

Sneaky

#57 Greg Grant

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Posted 15 March 2003 - 12:05 AM

The positional audio from the Miles Sound System produces sound a prologic fashion, I haven't tried it yet myself since I just received my Revolution today and as of this moment I only have two speakers on my receiver connected to my Mac.

The revolution supports 4.1 speakers and mixes the center channel among the two main speakers when using SRS TruSurround.

It also should be noted you cannot use an analog system without a Dolby Digital decoder if you intend to watch DVDs, thus you'll need an external decoder chipset with a receiver, or speakers with a digital input (internal chipset) or stand alone decoder (see the Jazz Speakers review).

RAD Game Tools replied, so here's a list of Macintosh games that use the Miles Audio Sound system, although do not necessarily support positional audio. Anyone who owns these games post feed back, I don't own any of the Miles supported games besides WarCraft 3 and Medal of Honor.

Shadowbane
Tony Hawk Pro Skater 3
Neverwinter Nights
Tropico: Mucho Macho Edition
Dungeon Siege
Stronghold
Survivor
Dragon's Lair 3D
American Idol
What's her Face
Curios George Downtown Adventure
Curios George Reading and Phonics
Tropico
Mavis Beacon Teaching Typing 15
and many other educational titles.
the IMG audio guy...

#58 a2daj

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Posted 15 March 2003 - 02:26 AM

Curious George?!?!?! SWEET!! I'm all over that!

#59 brown monk

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Posted 15 March 2003 - 04:25 AM

After playing around with the settings I finally got sound.  However, most of the alert sounds still play through the built-in speaker and the keyboard controls do nothing for the volume.

Anyway, onto greener pastures...Anyone using Logi's z680 with this board and happy with it?  I know pfc_biohzrd mentioned some hissing sounds and some front speaker problems...anyone else?  I can get these speakers for about $290 at buy.com (with a $15 coupon)...any other speaker suggestions?

#60 a2daj

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Posted 15 March 2003 - 05:06 AM

Well, I've been messing around with MoH and the s_milesdriver cvar (using a 5.1 analog speaker setup) and have noticed a few things.
First here's what I did for my test.  I turned on God mode and then entered a room where there was one person with a SMG.  I then positioned my character so that he was getting shot from the rear right side.
The default sound driver, "Miles Fast 2D Positional Audio", is for, well, 2D Positional Audio. Even with the Revo's Circle Surround enabled the sound was biased toward 2D sound.  You can also use "Dolby Surround" as the s_milesdriver cvar.  The difference is very noticeable, however, I still don't get a feeling of being surrounded.  There's an overall bias toward the left front speaker.  Sound can be heard from all the speakers but usually the rear speakers sound identical (which, now that I think about it, is most likely because it's Dolby Surround/Pro Logic and not Pro Logic II...) and my gun firing is loudest out of the left front speaker.

I'm not sure how to test WCIII.  That was actually the very first game I used to test my Revo when I first got it, but without knowing what to listen for I couldn't figure out if it helped or not.

I'm on the ShadowBane beta test team and I don't really hear much in terms of 3d positional sound.  But I haven't played for almost a week because a server has been down everytime I have a chance to test.