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The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim


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#21 The Liberator

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Posted 20 November 2011 - 06:46 AM

View PostSneaky Snake, on 19 November 2011 - 03:47 PM, said:

The UI is directly pulled from the console versions, meaning it's designed for the controller. It works alright on console, but terrible with kb/m. I expect that they'll patch it somewhat soon though for that.

the mod's always take bethesda's games, and make them a ton better. Oblivion had the most mods lol people did like everything in that world
Yeah, I am really interested in what the mods will be doing; can't wait.

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#22 Janichsan

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 04:28 AM

I've let myself being talked into buying Skyrim for my PS3 and man, do I have buyer's remorse...

I should have known better, since it's just as I imagined. Basically everything I didn't like about Oblivion and Fallout 3 is still there. The voice acting got slightly better – at least in the German version (they actually hired some professional voice actors this time) – but it's still grating. First of all, there are not enough voice actors: roughly one third of the male population of Skyrim sounds like Dr. Cox from Scrubs and significant part of the female populations sounds as if they are reading their dialog from a sheet. Secondly, NPCs still tend to repeat the same two lines every ten seconds.

I have mixed feelings about the graphics: in part, the game looks really pretty and a couple of the dungeons are really atmospheric. On the other hand, many textures are visibly pixelated and low resolution. Objects and characters often barely stand out from the background which tends to be a muddy mess of grey and brown. The character models shown in the loading screens are quite impressive – as long as they don't move. Unfortunately, the animations are very stiff and stilted. Most human characters' faces look as if the Betheda modelers never have seen a real human being. Especially unsettling are NPCs that do not blink a single time during their dialog – I had this a couple of times already. Furry beasts look as if they are made of plastic.

A single improvement I noticed: there seems to be less reuse of dungeons. Every dungeon I visited so far was really unique. Something that cannot be said about buildings and locations on the surface of Skyrim: I have encountered the same partly destroyed castle at least two times already, exactly the same towers also twice (possibly a third time within a town – I'm not completely sure), the same entrance to a tomb three times and most huts appear to be built after the same plans.

Combat is still clunky: melee consists of wildly flaying whatever you have in hand, magic combat boils down to aiming at your enemy and keeping the triggers pressed until it dies.

And finally, what's worst about Skyrim (and most other Bethesda RPGs I played): it's simply not immersive. The game completely fails to make me care about any character. There's hardly any atmosphere to speak of: towns don't feel like bustling centres of activity, most dungeons aren't creepy, combat feels unsubstantial (especially the fights against dragons I had so far – and those are allegedly a major selling point of the game), the quests are mostly uninteresting and just not involving. And even when there is a slight hint of immersion, the game manages to break it instantly: be it the shadows that jerk noticeably one position further when the suns moves on, enemies that get stuck on ridiculously tiny obstacles (like 5 centimetre high ledges...), NPCs that apparently teleport from one location to another, or simply an endless string of WTF moments that just leave me incredulous (examples include a dragon that ravages a complete town at the beginning of the game and that turns out to be killable with not more than half a dozen of flimsy arrows; a Stormcloak rebel encampment right beside a major road – on which I passed an Imperial patrol not 50 metres ago; said Stormcloak rebels telling me – a complete stranger – straight away where to find their leader – who barely escaped execution at the beginning of the game and is on the run; a necromancer performing his dark rites in broad daylight and plainly visible from the road – on which guards patrol; NPCs who by no means could know of the return of the dragons talking some crap as if dragons were the scourge of the land for decades now; companions that get launched hundred of metres in the air by an attacking giant and turning up completely unharmed a few minutes later; this list could go on and on...).

To cut a long story short: meh. Skyrim is definitely one of the most overrated games of this year. I'll see if can trade it in for something I'd like more...

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#23 The Liberator

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 07:08 AM

View PostJanichsan, on 29 November 2011 - 04:28 AM, said:

I've let myself being talked into buying Skyrim for my PS3 and man, do I have buyer's remorse...

To cut a long story short: meh. Skyrim is definitely one of the most overrated games of this year. I'll see if can trade it in for something I'd like more...
Fair enough. I have finally received the game. When I properly have time to set everything up, including making Win 7 not screw with OSX I shall give an account of the game.

Liberator.

By the way Jan, did you like Morrowind?

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#24 Janichsan

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 08:16 AM

View PostThe Liberator, on 29 November 2011 - 07:08 AM, said:

By the way Jan, did you like Morrowind?
I have to admit that I never found the opportunity to really dig into that game. I had short playing stints on a friend's Windows PC back then and later (more or less successfully) managed to install the game via CrossOver, but that's about it. I already never really got a grasp on the combat back then, though.

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#25 The Liberator

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 08:25 AM

View PostJanichsan, on 29 November 2011 - 08:16 AM, said:

I have to admit that I never found the opportunity to really dig into that game. I had short playing stints on a friend's Windows PC back then and later (more or less successfully) managed to install the game via CrossOver, but that's about it. I already never really got a grasp on the combat back then, though.
I am pretty much in the same situation as you. I never owned it myself; only ever playing it at a friend's house. I think I racked up less than twenty hours. I also found the combat lacking, and left a lot to be desired. I could still look past it most of the time though.

Liberator.

P.S. Does anyone know if Skyrim is playable via crossover? I might install it that way, if possible.

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#26 Janichsan

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 08:48 AM

View PostThe Liberator, on 29 November 2011 - 08:25 AM, said:

P.S. Does anyone know if Skyrim is playable via crossover?
The CrossOver compatibility database does. :P

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#27 Hansi

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 08:50 AM

View PostThe Liberator, on 29 November 2011 - 08:25 AM, said:

P.S. Does anyone know if Skyrim is playable via crossover? I might install it that way, if possible.

Mouse lags too much. Cider is a better option, but obviously a gray legal area.

#28 Tacohead

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 10:50 AM

View PostThe Liberator, on 29 November 2011 - 08:25 AM, said:

I am pretty much in the same situation as you. I never owned it myself; only ever playing it at a friend's house. I think I racked up less than twenty hours. I also found the combat lacking, and left a lot to be desired. I could still look past it most of the time though.

Liberator.

P.S. Does anyone know if Skyrim is playable via crossover? I might install it that way, if possible.

The Porting Team has a wrapper that apparently works perfectly.

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#29 Tacohead

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 11:17 AM

View PostJanichsan, on 29 November 2011 - 04:28 AM, said:

Combat is still clunky: melee consists of wildly flaying whatever you have in hand, magic combat boils down to aiming at your enemy and keeping the triggers pressed until it dies.

To me, first-person shooter-type reflexes have no place in RPGs. You build your character's stats and let those choices play out automatically during combat, while still maintaining strategic control over the battle (if that makes sense). The combat in Skyrim seems to have more to do with reflexes (button-mashing) than anything. And it's repetitive and uninspiring button-mashing at that. It gets old pretty fast to me.

View PostJanichsan, on 29 November 2011 - 04:28 AM, said:

To cut a long story short: meh. Skyrim is definitely one of the most overrated games of this year. I'll see if can trade it in for something I'd like more...

There's something to be said for the big, beautiful open world in Skyrim. I have to admit it can be fun just sort of aimlessly wandering around and exploring. But there's just not much structure to the story aspect of the game. To be fair that would seem to be extremely difficult, if not impossible, to do in an open world designed game. I mean you can't have your cake and eat it too. it's something I really enjoyed in games like Dragon Age 1, Baldur's Gate 1 & 2, KotOR 1,  etc... and I miss it here. And of coarse there's the abysmal interface.

So I don't completely hate it but yeah it's overrated.

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#30 Tetsuya

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 12:24 PM

View PostJanichsan, on 29 November 2011 - 04:28 AM, said:

I've let myself being talked into buying Skyrim for my PS3 and man, do I have buyer's remorse...

I should have known better, since it's just as I imagined. Basically everything I didn't like about Oblivion and Fallout 3 is still there. The voice acting got slightly better – at least in the German version (they actually hired some professional voice actors this time) – but it's still grating. First of all, there are not enough voice actors: roughly one third of the male population of Skyrim sounds like Dr. Cox from Scrubs and significant part of the female populations sounds as if they are reading their dialog from a sheet. Secondly, NPCs still tend to repeat the same two lines every ten seconds.

I have mixed feelings about the graphics: in part, the game looks really pretty and a couple of the dungeons are really atmospheric. On the other hand, many textures are visibly pixelated and low resolution. Objects and characters often barely stand out from the background which tends to be a muddy mess of grey and brown. The character models shown in the loading screens are quite impressive – as long as they don't move. Unfortunately, the animations are very stiff and stilted. Most human characters' faces look as if the Betheda modelers never have seen a real human being. Especially unsettling are NPCs that do not blink a single time during their dialog – I had this a couple of times already. Furry beasts look as if they are made of plastic.

A single improvement I noticed: there seems to be less reuse of dungeons. Every dungeon I visited so far was really unique. Something that cannot be said about buildings and locations on the surface of Skyrim: I have encountered the same partly destroyed castle at least two times already, exactly the same towers also twice (possibly a third time within a town – I'm not completely sure), the same entrance to a tomb three times and most huts appear to be built after the same plans.

Combat is still clunky: melee consists of wildly flaying whatever you have in hand, magic combat boils down to aiming at your enemy and keeping the triggers pressed until it dies.

And finally, what's worst about Skyrim (and most other Bethesda RPGs I played): it's simply not immersive. The game completely fails to make me care about any character. There's hardly any atmosphere to speak of: towns don't feel like bustling centres of activity, most dungeons aren't creepy, combat feels unsubstantial (especially the fights against dragons I had so far – and those are allegedly a major selling point of the game), the quests are mostly uninteresting and just not involving. And even when there is a slight hint of immersion, the game manages to break it instantly: be it the shadows that jerk noticeably one position further when the suns moves on, enemies that get stuck on ridiculously tiny obstacles (like 5 centimetre high ledges...), NPCs that apparently teleport from one location to another, or simply an endless string of WTF moments that just leave me incredulous (examples include a dragon that ravages a complete town at the beginning of the game and that turns out to be killable with not more than half a dozen of flimsy arrows; a Stormcloak rebel encampment right beside a major road – on which I passed an Imperial patrol not 50 metres ago; said Stormcloak rebels telling me – a complete stranger – straight away where to find their leader – who barely escaped execution at the beginning of the game and is on the run; a necromancer performing his dark rites in broad daylight and plainly visible from the road – on which guards patrol; NPCs who by no means could know of the return of the dragons talking some crap as if dragons were the scourge of the land for decades now; companions that get launched hundred of metres in the air by an attacking giant and turning up completely unharmed a few minutes later; this list could go on and on...).

To cut a long story short: meh. Skyrim is definitely one of the most overrated games of this year. I'll see if can trade it in for something I'd like more...

I'm really glad to see so many intelligent gamers who didn't drink the Bethesda Kool-aid.  

This is pretty much how i feel, exactly.  I just dont understand the hype for these games.

#31 Janichsan

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 02:37 PM

View PostTacohead, on 29 November 2011 - 11:17 AM, said:

There's something to be said for the big, beautiful open world in Skyrim. I have to admit it can be fun just sort of aimlessly wandering around and exploring.
Yup, that's one of the few things that drives me in these games: the urge to explore what's to be found at that new, undiscovered location that just popped up in the compass. Unfortunately, it's more often than not very satisfying what I find there.

Quote

And of coarse there's the abysmal interface.
Completely forgot about that in my rant: the interface is utter crap even for controllers.

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#32 The Liberator

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 05:17 PM

View PostTacohead, on 29 November 2011 - 10:50 AM, said:

The Porting Team has a wrapper that apparently works perfectly.
Who are these guys? I assume they are neither to do with Crossover or Wine…?

Liberator.

Edit: Having now seen the Porting Team's port, the only issue that I can now think of is how it will work with a copy of Skyrim that I think needs Steam to activate it. It is one of the British Steamworks linked releases.

All the responses are much appreciated.

Edited by The Liberator, 29 November 2011 - 05:23 PM.

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#33 Hansi

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 05:45 PM

Install with a VM, real windows or Wineskin through Steam and then copy the installed folder to the Cider wrapper.

#34 The Liberator

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 06:41 PM

View PostHansi, on 29 November 2011 - 05:45 PM, said:

Install with a VM, real windows or Wineskin through Steam and then copy the installed folder to the Cider wrapper.
So, can I still use the OSX version of Steam, while mearly downloading the Wineskin for Skyrim, or is it more complicated than that?

Thanks, Lib. :)

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#35 Hansi

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 06:58 PM

Nope the OSX version won't work. But you can grab Wineskin install Steam in there and then download it into the wrapper and move to the cider wrapper once finished.

#36 The Liberator

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 08:27 PM

View PostHansi, on 29 November 2011 - 06:58 PM, said:

Nope the OSX version won't work. But you can grab Wineskin install Steam in there and then download it into the wrapper and move to the cider wrapper once finished.
Hmmm, I thought as much. That seems like much work, I'll see what is to be done.

Thanks again!

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#37 Thain Esh Kelch

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 05:33 AM

There'a also a cider version out on more shady sites.
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#38 Hansi

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 06:48 AM

View PostThain Esh Kelch, on 30 November 2011 - 05:33 AM, said:

There'a also a cider version out on more shady sites.

That is what we are talking about, shady is relative. Since it's a stripped version from a publicly available demo. I'm sure distribution is a grey area but if you download the demo and repurpose it on yourself to work that should be completely legal (in most countries)

#39 wfolta

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 01:35 PM

I knew Skyrim would never come to the Mac, so I finally caved and bought a System Builder version of Windows 7 and installed it under (Lion) Bootcamp. Runs great on my generation-pod MacBook Pro. For the record, you can also set up Virtualbox (free) to boot off of the Bootcamp partition, so if you ned to bring Windows up for a minute for a non-game task, you can do so without rebooting.  Way too slow for gaming, though. (I skipped the experimental 3D extensions, because of all of the dire security warnings.

Skyrim is super open-ended, and well thought out. The only thing that's a pain is the menu system, which was obviously designed for a console. Still, it's workable. There is a main quest line, 4 groups you can join and eventually become the head, three other groups that you can join for role playing and adventure. And it avoids the fatal flaw of most RPGs: no fixed classes. You can make any combination of skills that you want. Add in a crafting system that's useful and not a money-sink, and a HUGE area to explore, and it's amazing.

So right now, I'm essentially a magical ninja character that combines destruction magic with sneaking and ranged ambushes. I've been playing about 50 hours so far and have about 1/2 of the continent that I haven't even set foot in, and the parts I've been to still have lots of undiscovered places.

Highly recommended. I wish it was released on the Mac, and I think Bethesda would have a better product (particularly GUI) if they did develop for the Mac.

#40 Thain Esh Kelch

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 05:25 PM

View PostHansi, on 30 November 2011 - 06:48 AM, said:

That is what we are talking about, shady is relative. Since it's a stripped version from a publicly available demo. I'm sure distribution is a grey area but if you download the demo and repurpose it on yourself to work that should be completely legal (in most countries)
I'm talking about the full deal. :) Just pointing out that it presumably works (I haven't downloaded it).
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