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Aspyr: Empire at War Intel-only


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#21 Quicksilver

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 06:05 PM

View Postteflon, on February 1st 2007, 04:07 PM, said:

i dont get why people are getting so bitter about this.

That's the tough part about doing a hardware switch.  My G5 can destroy every Intel-based Mac out there, including the Mac Pro (unless you drop in a better GPU), but it can't play EaW.  Although I'd say that Aspyr is a bit early on committing to Intel now, we've seen this coming ever since the first Mactel came out, so it's time to suck it up and deal with it.  I just hope that Aspyr did their homework--while this may just be a false perception, I'd say that the majority of serious Mac gamers out there have G5s.  To be honest, the Mac Pro really isn't such a spectacular improvement over the G5 from a purely hardware standpoint, which is why I think that a lot of people have been holding on to their G5s.
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#22 Tesseract

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 06:06 PM

View Postv-i-c-, on February 2nd 2007, 10:12 AM, said:

For me this decission of aspry is the reason to boycott this company and their (universal) games from now on. There are other companies and other great games i can choose like aspyr choosed that they don't want me as customer.
Um, yeah... Are you boycotting Freeverse too, since HOMMV is Intel-only? Would you be boycotting Aspyr if they had simply chosen not to port EAW at all?

#23 Douglas

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 06:16 PM

View PostQuicksilver, on February 1st 2007, 04:05 PM, said:

That's the tough part about doing a hardware switch.  My G5 can destroy every Intel-based Mac out there, including the Mac Pro (unless you drop in a better GPU), but it can't play EaW.  Although I'd say that Aspyr is a bit early on committing to Intel now, we've seen this coming ever since the first Mactel came out, so it's time to suck it up and deal with it.  I just hope that Aspyr did their homework--while this may just be a false perception, I'd say that the majority of serious Mac gamers out there have G5s.  To be honest, the Mac Pro really isn't such a spectacular improvement over the G5 from a purely hardware standpoint, which is why I think that a lot of people have been holding on to their G5s.

You know with Intel mac's being able to run the Windows version of games, I would think that the PPC userbase is the MAIN reason to bother porting a game to the Mac platform at all.  Honestly, I think that only supporting the Intel base at this point is extremely premature, but that's just my 2 cents.

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 06:19 PM

View PostDouglas, on February 1st 2007, 06:16 PM, said:

You know with Intel mac's being able to run the Windows version of games, I would think that the PPC userbase is the MAIN reason to bother porting a game to the Mac platform at all.  Honestly, I think that only supporting the Intel base at this point is extremely premature, but that's just my 2 cents.

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Couldn't agree more...

#25 kingarthur_kom

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 06:21 PM

View PostTesseract, on February 1st 2007, 06:06 PM, said:

Um, yeah... Are you boycotting Freeverse too, since HOMMV is Intel-only? Would you be boycotting Aspyr if they had simply chosen not to port EAW at all?

Well I suppose I am boycotting but not by my own choice.  I have a PPC Mac and no new games really work that well. I guess Mac gaming is on its last legs. Sad really. A while back I had gotten a PC to play Battlefield 1942. I just didn't want to be left out when all my other friends played together.

#26 pofox

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 06:22 PM

View PostEric5h5, on February 2nd 2007, 08:43 AM, said:

Nope.  Some of us PPC users were pretty much assuming it would end up Universal because the system requirements aren't as high as all that, but we didn't know about the PPC/x86 multiplayer glitch which, I think, might have been the deciding factor.  Oh well, I'll pick it up in a few years...maybe by then it will have a discount price too. ;)

Oh, and boycotting Aspyr is childish.  I mean really.

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Exactly my thoughts. Talk of boycotts is so petulant. As a mac user AND a star wars fan (yes, I own Jar Jar boxers) , I am more disappointed than angry. It's either this or wait a few more months for a UB game with networking issues - imagine the backlash on that. This is an example of the intel transition effectively delivering on its potential of giving companies like Aspyr the ability to bring a game to market quicker and cleaner - albeit at the expense of us PPC folk, but it bodes well for the future of mac gaming. Look on the bright side!

#27 teflon

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 06:38 PM

View Postv-i-c-, on February 1st 2007, 11:12 PM, said:

For me this decission of aspry is the reason to boycott this company and their (universal) games from now on. There are other companies and other great games i can choose like aspyr choosed that they don't want me as customer.

firstly, this is such a silly reaction.
this has been coming a long time, and weve all had a year and 6 months to get ready for this sucker punch to the face.

and how can you boycott something if you cant buy it (not physically, but i mean buy it and be able to play it) in the first place?
its like saying im boycotting the PS3 cos its not out over here yet... therefore I wont buy one :P
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#28 Lucas 1977

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 07:42 PM

I am not affected by these news directly, since on monday I got a MBP 2.0 128mb vram, but i am disappointed that Aspyr has decided to dump development of PowerPC based Mac games, so soon, especially as the masjority of Mac users still have PPc machines.

I am wondering about the system specs which Aspyr has posted for this Game. It seems like this game has much higher vram and ram requirements than the PC counterpart. I am wondering if this means that the Mac version will have nicer graphics or the Aspyr has done a very bad conversion which requires 4x more vram to present the same quality graphics as the PC version? This is especially disappointed since it would seem logical that since the drop the PPC compatibility, this intel only version would have at lest comparable graphics to the PC version.

The Mac Specs
MINIMUM SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS:
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.4.8 or later
CPU Processor: Intel Chipset
CPU Speed: 1.83 GHz
Memory: 512 MB or higher
Hard Disk Space: 3.5 GB Hard Drive Space
Video Card (ATI): Radeon X1600
Video Card (NVidia): Geforce 7300
Video Chipset (Intel): GMA 950
Video Memory (VRam): 64 MB
Media Required: DVD Drive
MULTIPLAYER REQUIREMENTS:
Internet(TCP/IP) or LAN play supported
Internet play requires broadband connection
NOTICE: Cross platform play not supported. Mac to Mac internet play only.
RECOMMENDED SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS:
CPU Speed: 2.0 GHz
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.4.8
Memory: 1 GB
Video Memory (VRam): 256

PC Version
Required: 100% DirectX 9.0c compatible computer
Operating Systems Windows 2000 and XP Windows 98 and ME (Unofficially Supported)
CPU Required: Intel P3 1 GHz or AMD Athlon 1 GHz Recommended: Intel P4 1.5 GHz or AMD Athlon XP 1500+
Memory Required: 256 MB RAM Recommended: 512 MB RAM
Graphics Card Required: 32 MB 3D Graphics card with Hardware Transform and Lighting (T&L) Capability Recommended: 64 MB 3D Graphics card with Vertex Shader and Pixel Shader (VS/PS)

#29 bobbob

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 10:03 PM

View PostLucas 1977, on February 1st 2007, 07:42 PM, said:

I am wondering about the system specs which Aspyr has posted for this Game.

It lists VRAM twice, so they made a mistake, but the gist is that they're listing pretty much every Intel Mac except a POS 1.6 GHz Mini  Core Solo, and the PC min requirements are the minimum to have a stuttery mess in a large battle.

#30 Arenzera

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 10:08 PM

OmniGroup statistics show that there aren't as many PPC Mac users as some might think.

Why should Aspyr port a game to G5 iMacs and PowerMacs for them to run at a pathetic frame rate? They'll be the only PowerPC computers that run the game acceptably. IMHO, no new game from Aspyr should run on PowerPC Macs - they perform too slow for gaming and a small percentage of Mac gamers would actually own one (as opposed to an Intel Mac).

I think Apple saved the Mac game market by moving to Intel.

#31 dokter_mac

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 10:28 PM

Hi,
i'm also disappointed that it's Intel only. And i do not understand all the arguments from Aspyr.
Since i'm under NDA i can say much, but i can say this:
-I'm testing 5 games for a company, which are bringing new games to the Mac. We have started 2 new games with binaries that where Intel only, and from there we added the PPC code. Line by line. After a few weeks we have Universal binaries for those games.
-So it's not a PPC game that's being ported to Universal, but Intel Mac binaries to Universal! It was Windows to Intel-Mac and then added PPC code making it Universal.

Why can't Aspyr release a Intel Game for the Mac and add the PPC code later? Even if we have to play on differant servers, it's not the first game that PPC-gamers only could play online with other PPC-gamers.
Since there are still much more PPC-Macs i think it's much to soon for Intel only apps.
I don't talk abouth pro-apps like from Adobe, i was thinking that Adobe would be the first with Intel only Apps and don't bother abouth Universal...

So the honor is for Aspyr. I hope this is not the beginning from now on, that every new engine will be Intel only.
Still hoping for a PPC release, i would be happy to pay for it. Even if i have to wait another year for the release of it. I can be that hard...
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#32 dokter_mac

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 10:43 PM

View PostArenzera, on February 2nd 2007, 05:08 AM, said:

OmniGroup statistics show that there aren't as many PPC Mac users as some might think.

Why should Aspyr port a game to G5 iMacs and PowerMacs for them to run at a pathetic frame rate? They'll be the only PowerPC computers that run the game acceptably. IMHO, no new game from Aspyr should run on PowerPC Macs - they perform too slow for gaming and a small percentage of Mac gamers would actually own one (as opposed to an Intel Mac).

I think Apple saved the Mac game market by moving to Intel.
What about Prey? That game is running very smooth. Even Aspyr is saying that :-)
It even runs on G4 PM with a good graphics-card. It's a good example on how a game can run good on both PPC and Intel!
I run it with all details at high, with shadows and in 1680x1050 with no problems.
I think you are very wrong abouth the PPC gamers numbers.
Apple hardware from 2002 is still good for playing a high end game. And there are much more PPC Macs then Intel Macs!
If you think that after 1 year making Intel Macs that there are more Intel Macs then PPC Macs you got it realy wrong.
Claiming that PPC-Macs are slow is not right too. Prey is very good example! It's a very complicated game engine and it's running real good on PowerMacs (G5 and G4). Good job Aspyr!

And when Leopard will arrive, PPC Macs will run those games even faster then now with Tiger.
Kind regards

#33 Riko

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 11:31 PM

I remember the time 'we' had to switch from the good old 68030/68040 to the PPC.
And dang I just had bought a 'heavty' Mac II FX. I hung to it with my live but had to
let go after not that long. just too many PPC only products that came out.
According to Apple then, it was a 'smooth' transition....

Reading this topic, first slightly *p*-off, cause I too had hoped to play this game on my G4,
it looks like most of you knew this day was coming, only not when.

So Aspyr dropped the bomb. Look at it from this side; it's a company with as purpose soley
to make money.
If they leave the *shrinking* PPC userbase out for this game, it probably means that there are
enough users on the *growing* MacIntel platform, to make this game profitable for them.

It's the most hard thing for people who recently bought a G5, who might feel their mighty tower is left
out in the cold.
But that is not Aspyr's doing. Apple knew before they where releasing the G5 that they where
working on a new range of machines with Intel inside. Would they had told us so, lots of people
probably never would had bought a G5.

For myself I hope to buy somewhere this year a MacPro (starts praying now) and be on the rolling
band wagon again.
I also hope it will be the last time I ever have to 'switch' again. But well, that's probably
hoping against better judgement.

And, oh Docter_mac?
I wouldn't be surprised if 'Leopard' is more aimed towards the Intel machines, and less towards the PPC.
One day the Mac OS X box will read: 'IntelMac only'. And it might happen more sooner then we all think.

#34 Douglas

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 12:55 AM

You know, it's sad when a product (PPC G5) is deemed "obsolete" not because it CAN'T run the software, but because it is too INCONVIENENT to port the software to it....sad.

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#35 iRolley

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 01:28 AM

Nobody mentioned that this is Aspyr's first game to support the MacBook, IIRC. That's what Aspyr went after. There are many MacBook owners, maybe as many as G5 owners. I don't blame them on that choice, these MacBooks have a processor as powerful as some of the latest G5s.

#36 iRolley

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 01:39 AM

View Postdokter_mac, on February 1st 2007, 10:43 PM, said:

What about Prey? That game is running very smooth. Even Aspyr is saying that :-)
It even runs on G4 PM with a good graphics-card. It's a good example on how a game can run good on both PPC and Intel!
I run it with all details at high, with shadows and in 1680x1050 with no problems.
I think you are very wrong abouth the PPC gamers numbers.
Apple hardware from 2002 is still good for playing a high end game. And there are much more PPC Macs then Intel Macs!
If you think that after 1 year making Intel Macs that there are more Intel Macs then PPC Macs you got it realy wrong.
Claiming that PPC-Macs are slow is not right too. Prey is very good example! It's a very complicated game engine and it's running real good on PowerMacs (G5 and G4). Good job Aspyr!

And when Leopard will arrive, PPC Macs will run those games even faster then now with Tiger.
Kind regards

For most high end 3d games released today a G5 is required, with an upgraded GPU. G4's memory bus is way too slow. I'd say the potential PPC gamers are down to G5 owners. And of those, the 1.6, 1.8 G5 might be on the edge.

As for the Star Wars RTS, the decision was clearly not about performance, but since nobody is buying new PPC, might as well support the low end Intel Macs (MacBook and mini) which seem to be selling very well. Heck if Aspyr could get a demo of ST : EaW bundled on every one of these, that'd be amazing.

#37 Tesseract

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 02:05 AM

View PostArenzera, on February 2nd 2007, 03:08 PM, said:

OmniGroup statistics show that there aren't as many PPC Mac users as some might think.
Those stats, while interesting, are not derived from a random sample and should not be used as a basis for generalisations.

#38 teflon

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 02:11 AM

View PostLucas 1977, on February 2nd 2007, 01:42 AM, said:

I am wondering about the system specs which Aspyr has posted for this Game.

its simple. Theyve picked their sweetpoint with CPU speed, and then put the base system specs which come for all the macs. imacs have either a X1600 or 7300, MBPs X1600, and Mac Pros come with a 7300 as standard. Macbooks get the GMA950. all these machines can play this game out of the box.
the only machine with the short straw would appear to be the mac mini which apparently doesnt have enough CPU power... which I dont quite believe.

hopefully theres a demo.
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#39 dokter_mac

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 06:33 AM

View PostRiko, on February 2nd 2007, 06:31 AM, said:

And, oh Docter_mac?
I wouldn't be surprised if 'Leopard' is more aimed towards the Intel machines, and less towards the PPC.
One day the Mac OS X box will read: 'IntelMac only'. And it might happen more sooner then we all think.
I'm sure that Leopard will support PPC untill 10.5.9 :-)
And i'm sure that all those G5 64 bits processors will run this OS update as good, maybe better, then Intel :-)
I have a dual G5 with a FSB @1.35Ghz and 8Gb RAM in combination with a ATI X800XT. This OS will scream on my machine. And my apps will too, even the 32 bits apps.
If companys would upgrade there apps to 64bit , which is real simpel in some cases, you could be surprise which processors are the fastest.

The switch from 68030/68040 to the PPC has been smooth, and apps for both procs have been released for many years side by side.
I know because i was there too :-) I have seen at least 2 or 3 years both 68k and PPC apps.
Regards

#40 strangemax

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 08:45 AM

Well considering the desert that was mac gaming last year, you had to see the writing on the wall. It's a tough time to be a mac publisher these days, I for one am glad to see Aspyr isn't dumping the Mac totally.
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