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Stubbs the Zombie - or -


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#21 Dark_Archon

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Posted 28 March 2006 - 09:24 PM

If you are going with checkpoints, they should be relatively close together. I only played the demo of Stubbs, but I don't remember having the ability to save.

Being able to mess around, and not lose a lot of progress is important in a game. Once and a while in Halo, I found myself unable to resist the urge of doing something stupid like driving over a waterfall in the warthog, or seeing how far I could blast my body if I pointed the rocket launcher downwards. I felt that checkpoints were well spaced in Halo, and allowed you to do stuff like that without worrying about have to redo the whole level.
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#22 electricdawn

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Posted 29 March 2006 - 10:08 AM

View Postthe Battle Cat, on March 28th 2006, 11:26 PM, said:

Well tell us what he SAID you chittering Pfhor Looker!!
Yes, in the full game the keyboard controls are fully customizable.


Chitterchitterchitter...BANGpiu-BANG-BANG...chittuaaAAARGHhhhh...erh...were was I?

Ok, I just asked for his permission to post it. I hope he replys soon.

v/r, E.

#23 electricdawn

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Posted 31 March 2006 - 12:26 PM

View Postelectricdawn, on March 29th 2006, 06:08 PM, said:

Chitterchitterchitter...BANGpiu-BANG-BANG...chittuaaAAARGHhhhh...erh...were was I?

Ok, I just asked for his permission to post it. I hope he replys soon.


Sorry, just got an email from him back, he says no. Just thought I let you guys know.

v/r, E.

#24 Batcat

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Posted 31 March 2006 - 10:55 PM

AAAAAAARGH!!! :wall:


:crying:

#25 dimmer

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Posted 05 April 2006 - 04:20 PM

Hmm, interesting - do we know where iTunes puts the m4p files? iPhoto the photos? Isn't Searchlight designed around the concept of "Oh, just save them in the Word folder, they'll be fine"? I don't like the XP ways of things much (if it's called MY DOCUMENTS it should be for MY DOCUMENTS! For crying out loud) - but I also don't like the intrusiveness of "Oh, time to save the game as you are about to get your ass handed to you on a plate" either. Maybe a startup dialog the first time you run the game that asks where to store the save files? Oh, and yes - save anywhere isn't a feature, it's a must have. Really. For me.

#26 Frost

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Posted 01 May 2006 - 05:08 PM

Just to weigh in with one of my overly weighty opinions, I have to agree I really don't like checkpoint saving. Though it's not as bad as it used to be, the game that really burned my ass with that was Oni. Now, it's not so bad on easy difficulty levels, but when you're trying to prove your vidmasterly skills by beating the game with the hardest setup possible it's quite a different story. It tends to elicit many a rapidly hurled curse when you go through two checkpoints by walking down a hall, then have to go through a fight with 4 top-level ninjas with an instant-kill sniper watching you and jump over 4 instant death chasms without one @#^%ing save.

I agree with tBC on the experimentation thing too. Not that I experimented all that much with Marathon, but with all the zillion things you can do in Halo, I REALLY wish you'd at least be allowed like 2 or 3 quicksaves per level just to allow you to see if you can make that chasm jump with a Warthog or land on the 2 foot ledge 80 feet down just above the burning plasma ocean or somesuch craziness. There are many points I wanted to play with stuff like that in Halo and I was faced with the option of going through 2 or 3 tedious and time consuming fights first just so I could set up a 3 second stunt. C'mon! The only level that was sort of friendly to a stunt man was Silent Cartographer since you could save anytime you wanted by simply rounding one of the island's four corners.

All that said, while Stubbs was okay and fun, I was definitely extremely unimpressed with its performance. Honestly, how many graphical goodies were added over Halo? Halo runs glass smooth with all options all the way up on my G4 1.42 with a GeForce 4 Ti 4600. Stubbs chokes and sputters on my cousin's dual 2.5 GHz G5 which I played it on, and honestly I don't think it even looked as pretty as Halo. Doom 3 and Quake 4 perform excellently on that machine with graphics options up pretty high. What's Stubbs' problem?
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When there's a multiplayer version, I'm going to be on Frost's team. Well, except he doesn't seem to actually need a team...I mean, what's the point? "Hey look, it's Frost and His Merry Gang of Useless Hangers-On!" Or something.

#27 Quicksilver

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Posted 01 May 2006 - 06:12 PM

Stubbs' "problem" if you will is the old film effect that Wideload added over the entire screen.  It's REALLY graphics-intensive, and personally, I didn't really appreciate the look anyway (it made everything dark and muddy).
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#28 Eric5h5

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 06:51 AM

View PostFrost, on May 1st 2006, 07:08 PM, said:

Stubbs chokes and sputters on my cousin's dual 2.5 GHz G5 which I played it on

Funny, it's perfectly smooth on mine...what graphics card does it have?  If it's low-end, that's the problem...but then, I wouldn't have expected Doom3 to do that great in that case.

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#29 the Battle Cat

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 07:22 AM

I found a game with checkpoint saves that I think has been done to my complete satisfaction.  Quake 4 has beginning of map saves and checkpoint saves just like Stubbs, but in addition (and this addition is CRITICAL to all my checkpoint complaints) it gives you 4 quick saves, the 5th quick save overwrites the oldest.  It was spectacular, I found the checkpoint saves to be a great automated safety net and not the harsh, unyielding, fun-draining overlord of the Oni/Halo/Stubbs games.
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#30 txa1265

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 07:40 AM

That's the thing, though - it actually provides extra flexibility.  Heck, I'm playing the new Ultold Legends PSP game and it has checkpoints that you can revisit as well as multiple save anywhere slots (don't know how many,  but I don't see a limit).

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#31 Batcat

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 08:25 AM

View Postthe Battle Cat, on May 2nd 2006, 08:22 AM, said:

I found a game with checkpoint saves that I think has been done to my complete satisfaction.  Quake 4 has beginning of map saves and checkpoint saves just like Stubbs, but in addition (and this addition is CRITICAL to all my checkpoint complaints) it gives you 4 quick saves, the 5th quick save overwrites the oldest.  It was spectacular, I found the checkpoint saves to be a great automated safety net and not the harsh, unyielding, fun-draining overlord of the Oni/Halo/Stubbs games.
You're gonna {ahem} love this, then... IIRC, the original, '98 Half-Life has well-chosen checkpoint saves, unlimited full saves, and 2 quick saves; a newer overwriting the older of the two existing. Should you want to keep a quicksave, just spawn there and promptly full save.


::ducks::

#32 Frost

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 12:33 PM

View PostEric5h5, on May 2nd 2006, 07:51 AM, said:

Funny, it's perfectly smooth on mine...what graphics card does it have?  If it's low-end, that's the problem...but then, I wouldn't have expected Doom3 to do that great in that case.

I think it might be some model of Radeon 9800? Or maybe an X800, I really don't remember what it was he bought. I'll check next time I talk to him. But yeah, since I can't run Doom 3 or Stubbs I played through them on his machine when we had one of the LAN parties we have every 6 months or so. Except for a scant few places Doom 3 ran wonderfully, but there were several points at which Stubbs was chugging like a Model T trying to keep up in the Indy 500. As expected, that elicited a very large What the?! reaction from both of us. We never figured a way to speed Stubbs up.

View Postthe Battle Cat, on May 2nd 2006, 08:22 AM, said:

I found a game with checkpoint saves that I think has been done to my complete satisfaction.  Quake 4 has beginning of map saves and checkpoint saves just like Stubbs, but in addition (and this addition is CRITICAL to all my checkpoint complaints) it gives you 4 quick saves, the 5th quick save overwrites the oldest.  It was spectacular, I found the checkpoint saves to be a great automated safety net and not the harsh, unyielding, fun-draining overlord of the Oni/Halo/Stubbs games.
See, that's the kind of save system I think is the absolute best. It gives the developer the ability to force the chronic savers to enjoy themselves, gives people like me a safety net (I lost count of the times I've gotten on an unstoppable roll, never thought of saving, then did something stupid, died, and had to go back through 2 hours of progress...), and also lets you save in the event you want to try something or are about to encounter something huge that the developer didn't foresee when they put in the checkpoints. All bases are covered.
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Eric5h5:
When there's a multiplayer version, I'm going to be on Frost's team. Well, except he doesn't seem to actually need a team...I mean, what's the point? "Hey look, it's Frost and His Merry Gang of Useless Hangers-On!" Or something.

#33 Dr. Geebs

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 12:52 PM

Stubbs chugs quite a bit even on a dual 2.5 / x800, at 1024x600.

#34 teflon

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 01:36 PM

turn the resolution down to 1024x768 or 800x600 a bit, and ramp up the FSAA. The full screen pixel shaders are a lot heavier that FSAA, and thats why it runs like a 3 legged dog in porridge which had extensive electro-shock therapy as a puppy, and was made to watch films of bombs falling on cities for 2 years solid, whilst on a drip to keep it alive.

Q4s save system sounds ace... im sure ill give it a go at some point... well see.
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#35 the Battle Cat

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 04:20 PM

View PostBatcat, on May 2nd 2006, 07:25 AM, said:

You're gonna {ahem} love this, then... IIRC, the original, '98 Half-Life has well-chosen checkpoint saves, unlimited full saves, and 2 quick saves; a newer overwriting the older of the two existing. Should you want to keep a quicksave, just spawn there and promptly full save.
::ducks::
I forgot the full save.  At any point in Quake 4 you can do a full save of the game using the name of your choice.
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#36 Eric5h5

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 05:51 PM

View PostDr. Geebs, on May 2nd 2006, 02:52 PM, said:

Stubbs chugs quite a bit even on a dual 2.5 / x800, at 1024x600.

The demo doesn't even chug a little bit with that setup, at 1280x960.  I started at 800x600 because of hearing about performance issues, but didn't notice any and bumped it up and still didn't notice any.  The occasional slight blips when checkpoint saving is all.  Is the full game a lot more intensive or something?  There are a couple of levels in Halo that still suffer noticeable framerate issues...the fire effects seem to be what does it.

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#37 Quicksilver

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 07:00 PM

My system could just barely handle 1024x768 with all of the goodies on [the full game], so that makes me wonder what's going on!
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#38 Batcat

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Posted 03 May 2006 - 12:13 AM

Quote

Worg: It would seem a 'city of the future' would be a good place to work in some eye candy, but the full-screen pixel shader Wideload has mentioned - to get that grainy 'old-movie look' - seems like it might negate much of 'the shiny' so beloved of fans of the engine's parent game. Conversely, with normal maps on everything and 'other graphical flash' mentioned by Alex (Seropian) in interviews, there seems room to take advantage of newer videochips. Is any further flash added for supported cards, perhaps in alternate rendering paths? If not, has some of the work been consolidated into more efficient code for better framerates and/or sparing of video horsepower for things like anisotropic filtering on the newer cards? Will we get to see light blooms thru old-movie grain, or fancier flashes from the R&D guys' weapons?

Glenda: We're working to make some of the 'old-movie look' a bit more subtle on the PC & Mac. Since you can run at a higher resolution, making it look very grainy doesn't work as well compared to the Xbox. There are some really nice effects on the high tech weapons, and a lot of layered shader effects to add to the game's atmosphere. On the PC & Mac we're mainly using higher end video cards to support higher resolutions. It's a bit surprising, but because the game uses several passes of full screen pixel shaders to actually tweak the scene after it is rendered, it can put a huge strain on the pixel fill rate of the video cards. This wasn't a problem on the Xbox where it was locked to 640x480, but doing 6 passes of a pixel shader on every pixel on the screen in a frame's post-processing adds up computationally very quickly, especially at 1024x786 or higher resolutions. So it's taking every bit of the video card's cycles to keep things running smoothly.

Worg interview with Glenda Adams

#39 the Battle Cat

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Posted 03 May 2006 - 09:31 AM

Just so you know folks, Worg = Batcat in that interview.
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#40 Batcat

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Posted 04 May 2006 - 07:35 AM

Aw, shucks.

Anyway it seemed best to just go to the source for the explanation.