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#241 Ichigo27

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Posted 07 January 2021 - 10:03 PM

View PostSneaky Snake, on 06 January 2021 - 11:37 AM, said:


On the Xbox side, many of their games have received Series X/S patches with Halo MCC, Gear5, Forza, Sea of Thieves, and other games all getting next gen patches.

I take it that for official backwards compatible support for original xbox games as of late, JSRF, Stubbs The Zombie, Otogi, Unreal Championship 1 and Shenmue 2 didn't make the cut? What about King of Fighters 2002/2003? DOA Ultimate?

Putting aside how underwhelming the Xbox series S and X look, and excluding the demon souls remake on the playstation 5, I watched a few videos on youtube of Dreams running on the playstation 5. That game runs past 30 fps compared to the PS4 Pro. Though if I could afford a console at this time, I have a backlog of physical playstation 4 games that I'd like to play on top of whats going to come down the pipeline for that console. Personally,  Zero Horizon Dawn doesnt look like its as fun as Ni-Oh, let alone Ghost Of Tsushima.
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#242 Sneaky Snake

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 08:54 AM

Quote

I take it that for official backwards compatible support for original xbox games as of late, JSRF, Stubbs The Zombie, Otogi, Unreal Championship 1 and Shenmue 2 didn't make the cut? What about King of Fighters 2002/2003? DOA Ultimate?

I don't have experience with those games, but if they were backwards compatible on Xbox One then they will work great on Series S/X as well. I was referring to games that have received an actual Series S/X patch to make then run at better graphics, higher resolution, and/or higher framerate compared to the Xbox One versions of the game. Halo MCC collection for example runs at 4K/60 fps on Xbox One X and 4K/120fps on Series X. Every Xbox One game (includes older titles that are backwards compatible) works as good or better on Series S/X. Some games have received an update to take advantage of the Series S/X additional power - that is what I was referring to.

With the PS5 Sony has made it backwards compatible with all PS4 games, but they have done a poor job at updating at least some of their flagship titles to be optimized for the PS5, in order to give PS5 players a significantly better experience. The Last of Us 2 came out in June 2020 but it has zero PS5 optimization for example (I'm sure Sony is getting ready to sell a PS5 "definitive edition" of the game again for full price - same as what they did with Last of Us 1)

For example, God of War makes you choose between 1080p/60fps or 4K/30fps on PS4 Pro - and the identical options are the only ones available on PS5. People have discovered that if you install the base 1.0 version of the game from the disc that you have an unlocked framerate at 4K, which allows the PS5 to do 4K/60 fps. Unfortunately running this 1.0 version of the game means your save is not compatible and you have to block the internet/updates for the game or else you will lose 60 fps. Just one small example of how trivial it would be for Sony to patch at least an unlocked framerate back into the game and give PS5 players a better experience - but they seem to have no intention of doing so.

The only PS4 exclusive that has been patched for PS5 is Ghost of Tsushima as far as I'm aware. A fantastic game, but kind of disappointing that it is the only one out of Sony's vast library of exclusives
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#243 Ichigo27

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 02:24 PM

I don't know where my copy of Unreal Championship 2 went, I do think that it can run on a series X though. Compared to the first championship game.

View PostSneaky Snake, on 08 January 2021 - 08:54 AM, said:

The only PS4 exclusive that has been patched for PS5 is Ghost of Tsushima as far as I'm aware. A fantastic game, but kind of disappointing that it is the only one out of Sony's vast library of exclusives

But you don't know for a fact that Dreams runs as well as shown on other youtube videos? See, if I could afford a PS5, I'd like to use that game creation tool. I am aware that Ghost Of Tsushima runs faster though on one. Though when I heard of the last of us 2, and the God of War reboot, it looked kind of boring.
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#244 Tetsuya

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 05:59 PM

View PostSneaky Snake, on 06 January 2021 - 03:01 PM, said:

I view the Xbox as less of a PC replacement and more as a PC couch companion. The majority of my gaming is done on my PC with keyboard and mouse but sometimes I would just rather be on the main TV screen or perhaps I'm playing a game that lends itself to a console couch experience (Ex: racing games, sports games, puzzle games, etc.). Plus games that are "Play Anywhere" branded (most Microsoft games, plus some 3rd party ones) are cross save between PC and Xbox. So I can play a game on my PC and then move downstairs to the couch and pick up right where I left off.

I think this already got mentioned and im sure this post is old... but...

SteamLink is a thing.  The physical hardware is now long in the tooth (as it only supports 1080p/60) and not sold anymore, but Google's new Chromecast + TV dongle (for 50$) supports 4k via the Steamlink app (and is easily the best Streaming TV Dongle available anywhere near that price unless Amazon owns your entire being).  Or there's the nVidia Shield which can use both Steamlink and the nVidia in home streaming to hit 4K/whateveryourTVsupports.  

With all First-party Xbox games also being day-and-date on Windows.... owning an Xbox if you already own a PC seems pointless.  If you want to enjoy it on your couch, you can, easily, Xbox controller and all (i use the Pro v2 Controller, which Steam just updated to allow you to remap the back paddles to unique keybinds instad of just standing in for face buttons).

View PostMatt Diamond, on 07 January 2021 - 08:59 AM, said:

You may have just stumbled on the one argument that will eventually convince me to get one. I don't want another computer to maintain-- one is bad enough!-- but there are PC games that I waver on. (Also, VR.)

See above.  Just get some variation of Steamlink capable hardware (Apple TV, any Chinesium Android TV box, nVidia Shield TV (get the Pro, the AI upscaling is the bees knees), or the Google Chromecast + TV.  

Poof.  No second PC.

#245 Tetsuya

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 06:06 PM

View PostDirtyHarry50, on 18 May 2018 - 12:23 PM, said:



Next gen 60 FPS 4K gaming on a $500. box will leave nothing left to hold you back.

Unfortunately reality has set in and people are starting to realize that while older games are quite capable of being run at 4k/60, for new AAA games, neither box can do 4k/60 at anything resembling Ultra settings.  

Which stands to reason since their GPUs are roughly equivalent to the RTX 3070 or the RX 6800 (somewhere in between really).  Neither of which is a 4k/60/high-ultra card.  

Even the 3080 and 6800XT/6900XT still struggle hitting 60fps in the high end AAA titles at 4k/ultra.  

Not by any means ALL games, even AAA games, but things like Crysis Remastered and Cyberpunk can already bring a 3080 to its knees (i have one; thank god for DLSS).  

And forget RT at 4k/60 on either of those consoles.  Forget RT at 4k, TBH.  

Not poopooing them.  For their price (if you can find one), theyre quite solid.  You certainly cant build a PC that performs as well for anywhere near that price point (since the GPU alone will be 450-550$).  Benefit of the being abe to sell at a considerable loss.  

But the 4K/60 hype/promises (to be fair to the console makers, i dont recall them promising the world here, i just recall a lot of FANS *assuming* it would be the case) are largely a non-starter.

#246 Matt Diamond

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Posted 08 January 2021 - 10:37 PM

View PostTetsuya, on 08 January 2021 - 05:59 PM, said:

See above.  Just get some variation of Steamlink capable hardware (Apple TV, any Chinesium Android TV box, nVidia Shield TV (get the Pro, the AI upscaling is the bees knees), or the Google Chromecast + TV.  

Poof.  No second PC.
Sorry, I wasn't very clear. I was using "PC" in the most general sense. I don't have a Windows PC (not counting an old Windows laptop that doesn't run very well). I have a Mac, and between that and being the tech support guy for the family at large, I don't feel like adding another desktop to the mix. A new XBox would be a good compromise.

I'm not going to act on this any time soon, unless Psychonauts 2 comes out and doesn't run on my Mac.

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#247 Tetsuya

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Posted 09 January 2021 - 03:02 AM

Well you can use Steamlink to stream your Mac too.  Doesn't require a PC.  So any time you feel like couching it, its there.  

Steamlinks are also good for simple Remote Desktop use (just select "Exit Big Picture Mode") - poof you're at the desktop.  Sound and everything.  

My wife uses a Steamlink (the actual hardware device, i bought 4 when they were 8$) in the basement paired with a keyboard and mouse and plugged into an old 22" TV to stream her Mac desktop so she has access to her computer in her sewing room without having to have an actual computer down there.  Listens to her music, or watches movies or whatever.  

Its way more useful than most people think.

#248 macdude22

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Posted 09 January 2021 - 12:24 PM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 08 January 2021 - 10:37 PM, said:

Sorry, I wasn't very clear. I was using "PC" in the most general sense. I don't have a Windows PC (not counting an old Windows laptop that doesn't run very well). I have a Mac, and between that and being the tech support guy for the family at large, I don't feel like adding another desktop to the mix. A new XBox would be a good compromise.

I'm not going to act on this any time soon, unless Psychonauts 2 comes out and doesn't run on my Mac.

You forgot that PC people are like car people and live with tunnel vision not understanding 95% of the market doesn't care to change their own oil or install 127 drives in a tower or have 7 cars or 7 desktop tower computers. Series X is amazing, the 2 year 0% financing with game pass is even better. Microsoft licked the support going back 4 generations (with caveats). I slapped a 2TB ebays cheapest Adata SSD into a 9 dollar OWC USB 3.0 enclosure and you've got warm SSD storage to transfer back and forth to the internal storage (non Series enhanced games run fine and fast off the external storage as well). I wasn't going to get Velocity Engine compatible storage until there are 2TB cards.
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#249 Cougar

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Posted 09 January 2021 - 01:00 PM

View PostTetsuya, on 08 January 2021 - 05:59 PM, said:

SteamLink is a thing.  The physical hardware is now long in the tooth (as it only supports 1080p/60) and not sold anymore, but Google's new Chromecast + TV dongle (for 50$) supports 4k via the Steamlink app (and is easily the best Streaming TV Dongle available anywhere near that price unless Amazon owns your entire being).  Or there's the nVidia Shield which can use both Steamlink and the nVidia in home streaming to hit 4K/whateveryourTVsupports.  


And donít forget Apple TV, what I use. Works great.

#250 Matt Diamond

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Posted 09 January 2021 - 01:57 PM

View Postmacdude22, on 09 January 2021 - 12:24 PM, said:

95% of the market doesn't care to [..] install 127 drives in a tower
[..]
I slapped a 2TB ebays cheapest Adata SSD into a 9 dollar OWC USB 3.0 enclosure

So:
* Adding drives to PC: bad
* Adding drives to XBox: good
Do I have that right?  ;-)

Quote

Microsoft licked the support going back 4 generations (with caveats).
Yes, this is a big draw for me.

I'm a die hard Mac gamer, and I still want to support that when possible, but if I did most of my gaming on a console my next Mac purchase would be a lot easier and cheaper.

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#251 Tetsuya

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Posted 09 January 2021 - 02:14 PM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 09 January 2021 - 01:57 PM, said:

my next Mac purchase would be a lot easier and cheaper.

Well, Apple's gonna make that call for you.  Dont expect a variety of hardware configs going forward.  =)

My only issue with "just get an Xbox" is that entire genres are basically MIA or barelly playable (Halo Wars tried very hard to make RTS work... and its.... like... kinda playable.  Sorta.  If you hate yourself).  And while it has backwards compatability with itself/its own ecosystem, its missing TONS of classic games because it doesn't really run ("real") Windows.  (though LTT did show some interesting emulation options if you have a developer account, which is cheap).  

A PC is a lot more versatily and still gets you all the worthwhile Xbox games (because of the day and date thing).  

However as i already mentioned, if you dont already have a PC, an Xbox or PS5 is going to get you a lot more bang for your buck because its a lot cheaper than any equivalent gaming PC will be.  The GPU alone would cost about the same as the entire console.

But if you already have a PC, even a halfway OK one, a GPU upgrade will get you the performance of the consoles or better and a lot more versatility.  If you dont, or you aren't into gaming as your primary hobby, then a 500$ console isn't necessarily a bad choice.  (Though id expect both consoles to go up in price here in about three weeks due to the fact that the tarriff that they dodged last year via an exception extension - didnt get extended this year.  GPUs and PCBs are due to go up between 15-25% and i expect that to include consoles, and i cant see the makes eating ANOTHER 125$+ loss on each console.  But that applies equally to PCs, so its a net 0).

#252 Ichigo27

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Posted 09 January 2021 - 07:26 PM

View PostTetsuya, on 09 January 2021 - 02:14 PM, said:

However as i already mentioned, if you dont already have a PC, an Xbox or PS5 is going to get you a lot more bang for your buck because its a lot cheaper than any equivalent gaming PC will be.  The GPU alone would cost about the same as the entire console.

As mentioned earlier by you, you did bring up lack of xbox only exclusive games. Thats a big turn off for me. Back in the early 2000s, the xbox did have exclusives from time to time that were great. Then after the original xbox, microsoft really did drop the ball on getting competent game developers to make games that were on par with the previous generation and no I'm not talking about overrated xbox titles like fable or halo for that matter. Looking back, it did not help that epic games refused to do anything groundbreaking with gears of war, and snowballing with halo 3 being a snorefest compared to how enjoyable killzone 2 was on the playstation 3 (I have played killzone 3 but it wasn't that much fun more like playing huge let down like Resistance 2).

If I had to choose, it appears that the playstation 5 would be more worth while for me given how many times microsoft has let me down in the console realm. They have to do a lot more than re releasing Phantom Dust to convince me to plunk down 500 dollars for a vertical taller G4 Cube looking Xbox Series X.
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#253 Sneaky Snake

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Posted 10 January 2021 - 07:59 PM

View PostTetsuya, on 08 January 2021 - 05:59 PM, said:

I think this already got mentioned and im sure this post is old... but...

SteamLink is a thing.  The physical hardware is now long in the tooth (as it only supports 1080p/60) and not sold anymore, but Google's new Chromecast + TV dongle (for 50$) supports 4k via the Steamlink app (and is easily the best Streaming TV Dongle available anywhere near that price unless Amazon owns your entire being).  Or there's the nVidia Shield which can use both Steamlink and the nVidia in home streaming to hit 4K/whateveryourTVsupports.  

With all First-party Xbox games also being day-and-date on Windows.... owning an Xbox if you already own a PC seems pointless.  If you want to enjoy it on your couch, you can, easily, Xbox controller and all (i use the Pro v2 Controller, which Steam just updated to allow you to remap the back paddles to unique keybinds instad of just standing in for face buttons).

I explained my reasoning for the Xbox over the PS5 above. Essentially I just found the Xbox to be a vastly better value with gamepass and I have a PS4 Pro that appears to be able to play virtually every Sony exclusive, even upcoming ones like the new God of War and HZD. Eventually I'll probably get a PS5 slim or something.

Steamlink certainly would be a good value if I wanted to just stream my PC games, but I also wanted stuff like 4K HDR support for media (including BluRays), and an actual dedicated game console that doesn't rely on my PC being turned on and logged in to work. Plus I play some games that are console exclusive with friends, such as the NHL games.
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#254 Tetsuya

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Posted 17 January 2021 - 01:52 AM

[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCvE4JGJujk&ab_channel=GamersNexus[/media]

Ouch.

"Its about a mid to high end gaming PC from five years ago".  

Keep in mind hes not poopooing it, reminding the PCMR people watching that its still a good experience.  

But.. yeah.  Im not exactly shocked, because "console settings" have never been comparable to PC Ultra settings even at the same resolutions.  

Interesting piece regardless.

#255 Sneaky Snake

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Posted 18 January 2021 - 11:59 PM

As a counter to that: DF concludes that around a 2080 Super is required to match the PS5's graphics and framerate in AC Valhalla. If you watch this video you'll see that "console settings" that you are so down on can actually be quite high compared to PC.

GN does great work, but I believe that the 1080p 120 fps focus of his video makes the consoles look way worse then what they are. This looks like a case of 3 lazily ported launch games that really were made for last gen consoles and next gen was an afterthought. If testing out the GPU was truly the goal of the video then why not do a 4K/60fps test vs PC, which is much more graphically demanding then 1080p/120fps

Also the quote "Its about a mid to high end gaming PC from five years ago" is just wrong. Nvidia's 10 series wasn't even announced 5 years ago - the 1070 Ti he was using came out Nov 2017 (3.15 years ago). Would love to see him do the same comparison with the 5 year old mid-range PC running COD:ColdWar, AC Valhalla, or WD:Legion vs the PS5/XsX.

EDIT: DF has now uploaded a PC vs PS5 graphics and framerate comparison video for COD Black Ops Cold War

It has a similar conclusion to AC Valhalla where a PC needs around a 2070 Super in order to match the PS5's graphical and framerate output. In regards to what PC settings the PS5 was closest to - it was a mix of medium, high, and ultra which the video goes through in detail.
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#256 Cobra

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Posted 28 April 2021 - 10:10 PM

I'm loving Game Pass and all of the backwards compatibility on my Xbox One X... so no rush for me getting a Series yet. If the next wave of backward compatible games are only compatible with the Series leaving out the One then I'll make the leap.