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So, Epic decided to start a p*ssing contest with Apple?


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#1 Janichsan

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Posted 15 August 2020 - 05:32 AM

I guess they won't be invited to WWDC any more.

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#2 Matt Diamond

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Posted 15 August 2020 - 12:09 PM

Google was also named in Epic's lawsuit, of course.

A multi-front war against enemies who have two of the largest armies (of lawyers) on the planet. What could possibly go wrong?

Unless... they actually have a good case? IANAL but it seems like a stretch. My guess is, even though the odds may be low, the amounts of money are so enormous that Epic thinks it's worth a shot.

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#3 Janichsan

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Posted 15 August 2020 - 01:13 PM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 15 August 2020 - 12:09 PM, said:

Unless... they actually have a good case? IANAL but it seems like a stretch. My guess is, even though the odds may be low, the amounts of money are so enormous that Epic thinks it's worth a shot.
I don't know and, to be honest, I don't really care. It's three multi-billion companies quarreling about who gets to make not just ridiculous amounts of money, but ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD!!! My sympathy for any of the involved sides is very limited.

What really pisses me off here, though, is that Epic stooped so low as to mobilise their fanbase of 10-year old impressionable kids to rouse some Twitter rabble. At the same time they paint themselves as brave underdog rebels fighting against evil oppressors, when in fact their only motivation is corporate greed.

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#4 Homy

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Posted 15 August 2020 - 06:11 PM

They simply want to make it easier for kids to become addicted to gambling by buying loot boxes through them...

#5 Ichigo27

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Posted 15 August 2020 - 11:00 PM

How does a company like Epic go from making incredible games like Unreal Tournament to Fortnite?
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#6 Thain Esh Kelch

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Posted 16 August 2020 - 12:26 AM

View PostIchigo27, on 15 August 2020 - 11:00 PM, said:

How does a company like Epic go from making incredible games like Unreal Tournament to Fortnite?
Kids these days.
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#7 Janichsan

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Posted 16 August 2020 - 03:00 AM

View PostHomy, on 15 August 2020 - 06:11 PM, said:

They simply want to make it easier for kids to become addicted to gambling by buying loot boxes through them...
I'm convinced that's at least an important part of their motivation.

The current system with Apple/Google controlling app store access and transactions has problems, but it definitely also has advantages: protection against scammers is one, giving parents simple means to limit their children's spending is another.

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#8 RGoulder

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Posted 16 August 2020 - 08:32 AM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 15 August 2020 - 12:09 PM, said:

A multi-front war against enemies who have two of the largest armies (of lawyers) on the planet. What could possibly go wrong?

Unless... they actually have a good case? IANAL but it seems like a stretch. My guess is, even though the odds may be low, the amounts of money are so enormous that Epic thinks it's worth a shot.

Hey I’m sure Epic Games legal arguments will be top notch, something along the lines of:


Apple and Google,

You guys are poopies.

Sincerely,

-Epic Games Legal Department


View PostJanichsan, on 15 August 2020 - 01:13 PM, said:

What really pisses me off here, though, is that Epic stooped so low as to mobilise their fanbase of 10-year old impressionable kids to rouse some Twitter rabble. At the same time they paint themselves as brave underdog rebels fighting against evil oppressors, when in fact their only motivation is corporate greed.

Agreed.

Epic games wants to portray itself as riding in on their high horse, protecting the innocent from Apple and Google's anti-competitive behavior.

All I see are three miniature ponies laden with bags of money ridden by expensive lawyers slapping each other repeatedly hoping some money might get knocked loose.

It’s fun to watch and all but this fight isn’t going to help the consumer regardless of who wins.

#9 the Battle Cat

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Posted 16 August 2020 - 09:35 AM

View PostJanichsan, on 15 August 2020 - 01:13 PM, said:

What really pisses me off here, though, is that Epic stooped so low as to mobilise their fanbase of 10-year old impressionable kids to rouse some Twitter rabble. At the same time they paint themselves as brave underdog rebels fighting against evil oppressors, when in fact their only motivation is corporate greed.

Any more twitter wars are fought mostly with bots.

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#10 Ichigo27

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Posted 16 August 2020 - 12:59 PM

View PostThain Esh Kelch, on 16 August 2020 - 12:26 AM, said:

Kids these days.

It was like ever since Gears of War being the mediocre game that it is, the company went downhill. Before that, I spent countless hours on deathmatch's in UT99, 2003, 2004, and then their was Unreal Championship 2, that game was a blast. Really is a shame.
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#11 Janichsan

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Posted 17 August 2020 - 01:39 PM

Things are heating up: Apple threatens to suspend Epic's developer accounts, which apparently would also effect the Unreal Engine and all games developed with it.

*popcorn munching intensifies*

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#12 Homy

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Posted 17 August 2020 - 02:03 PM

View PostJanichsan, on 17 August 2020 - 01:39 PM, said:

Things are heating up: Apple threatens to suspend Epic's developer accounts, which apparently would also effect the Unreal Engine and all games developed with it.

*popcorn munching intensifies*
Wow, I'm glad having my games on Steam, not MAS. :D

Update
Okay, good to hear: "No, that's not how it works. Every developer has got its own certificates. The only things that could disappear is Epic own softwares signed with Epic certificates. But I don't think they have any on the Mac App Store."

#13 Matt Diamond

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Posted 17 August 2020 - 04:43 PM

Apple sent Epic a long list of "here's what you are about to lose", most of which is the expected stuff like ability to sign apps, access to betas, etc. Plus the ARM devkit. Could be boilerplate they send to everyone. The last one was added specifically:

Quote

- Engineering efforts to improve hardware and software performance of Unreal Engine on Mac and iOS hardware; optimize Unreal Engine on the Mac for creative workflows, virtual sets and their CI/Build Systems; and adoption and support of ARKit features and future VR features into Unreal Engine by their XR team
In other words, Apple has engineering resources supporting Unreal Engine development.
Even if the court sides with Epic and forces Apple to keep them in the developer program, Apple can't be forced to give them that engineering support.

But then I wonder if Apple would pull that particular trigger. Sometimes companies put on a big show for a legal fight while unofficially letting the rank and file continue to do a little business Regardless how the legal fight plays out, it's in Apple's interest to have UE work well on Apple platforms. But Epic is willing to leverage its own popularity so Apple may very well withhold all support as threatened.

Quote

*popcorn munching intensifies*
Indeed!

Darn it, just got a kernel stuck in my teeth.

Existing versions of Fortnite still run for users, right? What if players discover that they like playing the game more WITHOUT forced updates, DLC, and opponents who can afford the best loot?

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#14 Camper-Hunter

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Posted 18 August 2020 - 01:32 AM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 17 August 2020 - 04:43 PM, said:

Existing versions of Fortnite still run for users, right? What if players discover that they like playing the game more WITHOUT forced updates, DLC, and opponents who can afford the best loot?

It's a (mostly) MP only game. Usually with these games, you can't connect to servers without having the latest client version.

#15 UmarOMC1

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Posted 18 August 2020 - 03:13 AM

So, three businessmen walk into a bar…the one introduces his new property to the others and is lured with the promise of more clients through them but they have to be guaranteed a cut…after awhile, the one starts decrying "injustice!" and "monopolizing tactics!" trying to paint the other two as such while attempting to paint himself as some sort of liberator…but at the end of the day they're three pimps.
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#16 the Battle Cat

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Posted 18 August 2020 - 01:05 PM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 17 August 2020 - 04:43 PM, said:

Darn it, just got a kernel stuck in my teeth.

Toothpicks are worthless for that.  Here, try my brand.

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#17 Homy

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Posted 21 September 2020 - 10:03 AM

Apparently Epic has been very demanding before and Apple has helped Epic and made many exceptions for them in the past: https://bgr.com/2020...hreats-revenue/

#18 Janichsan

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Posted 21 September 2020 - 04:06 PM

View PostHomy, on 21 September 2020 - 10:03 AM, said:

Apparently Epic has been very demanding before and Apple has helped Epic and made many exceptions for them in the past: https://bgr.com/2020...hreats-revenue/
That's the kind of service a 30% revenue share of one of the most profitable f2p games will buy you.

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