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Borderlands 3!

Borderlands Three Guns Guns Guns

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#181 Matt Diamond

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Posted 08 November 2019 - 05:39 AM

View PostUmarOMC1, on 08 November 2019 - 03:53 AM, said:

BTW, where's the output file saved?
Intel Power Gadget? When you turn off logging (which is what writes the file) it opens a dialog to tell you where the file is.
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#182 MrUNIMOG

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Posted 08 November 2019 - 11:58 AM

View Postmacdude22, on 06 November 2019 - 07:42 AM, said:

I want you to understand how not very pretty this looks at 1280x720 and Ultra Low settings. I have attached some screenshots from the mini.

It's playable in a technical sense that it's a fluid 25-30FPS. But it's like graphical quality between PS1 and PS2.

I have been unable to get the game to load on a 2018 Air (UHD 617) so the 630 may be the bottom bar.
Well that doesn't even look too bad, given how much below the official requirements that GPU is. I'm really impressed that it runs at all, even more so at 720p and decent framerates.
After all the (U)HD 630 is pretty much the same GPU as the Air's 617 (or the 12" MB's 615), just clocked a bit higher and with more thermal headroom. So the Air refusing to launch the game at all might perhaps be a CPU limitation?
The Mini's 630 performing like that certainly bodes well for recent 13" MBPs with GT3e iGPUs (Iris 540/550/640/650/645/655)
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#183 macdude22

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Posted 08 November 2019 - 12:43 PM

It launches on the Air but it locks up during the claptrap loading screen. I have set the config file by hand to various resolutions and graphic settings, which it respects but continues to lock up during the claptrap loading screen. The behavior is the same loading from the internal storage or external storage under 10.14 or 10.14. I feel like it should at least load. I assume there is some shader caching/computation here and that's where it's failing.
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#184 Matt Diamond

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 10:51 AM

View Postmacdude22, on 08 November 2019 - 12:43 PM, said:

I have set the config file by hand to various resolutions and graphic settings, which it respects but continues to lock up during the claptrap loading screen.

Where is that config file?

New behavior today: whenver I switch from Full Screen to Windowed Borderless, the game screen vanishes and the application stops responding. I just hear music until I force quit. Same behavior if I try to Cmd-Tab out while Full Screen. (I had no problems changing this setting when I first got the game.)
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#185 macdude22

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Posted 10 November 2019 - 02:25 PM

~/Library/Preferences/OakGame/GameUserSettings.ini
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#186 UmarOMC1

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 12:15 AM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 08 November 2019 - 05:39 AM, said:

Intel Power Gadget? When you turn off logging (which is what writes the file) it opens a dialog to tell you where the file is.
No, the Borderlands 3 demo run.
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#187 Matt Diamond

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 10:46 AM

View PostUmarOMC1, on 11 November 2019 - 12:15 AM, said:

No, the Borderlands 3 demo run.
I'll have a look for those logs tonight.

Brief update about my performance investigations:

I took logs with Intel Power Gadget but I don't know what the numbers mean.
Still I think it's safe to say my CPUs are throttling- it consistently all goes to popsnizzlee (as Zane might say) after about 1-1.5 hours. I tolerate this because I'm playing single-player and don't have much free time on weekdays anyway. But its a serious handicap to whatever mission I'm trying to finish when it happens, and multiplayer would be impossible.

So I've been looking for ways to run cooler. Unfortunately from what I've read, the Mini will use up any headroom I give it by bursting more. While this would help a video conversion finish sooner, it suggests I will  start throttling in B3 just as quickly as before. Still, one has to try.

I first tried using Mac Fan Control to change the fan curve, to make it hit max RPM at lower temperatures. The case feels cooler, and it might be allowing the game to partially recover between battles, but I still hit the initial problem after about 1.5 hours.

Got a few more things to try. (No, I will not be opening up the Mini to replace the thermal paste on the CPUs.)
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#188 ozzy

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 12:21 PM

The benchmark data gets saved in ~/Library/Application Support/GearboxSoftware/OakGame/Saved/BenchmarkData/. And then in that folder there is a .csv and .txt file for each benchmark run.

I played about an hour last night with my 2018 13" MBP 2.7 GHz i7 with 16 GB RAM and Vega 56 eGPU. I played on 1440p with slightly higher than Medium settings. Despite benchmarking at ~40 FPS, it was almost unplayable. On the second main map (where your town is) the frame rates are in the 25-30 FPS range, and sometimes when I am in certain areas or fighting it drops down to 15-20 FPS. I'll have to play around with the settings and see if I can get things a bit smoother on a lower resolution or with lower settings. I thought I'd be ok given benchmarking rates, but apparently not :).

I did benchmark my 2012 15" MBP with 2.6Ghz i7 (but now 7 years old), 8GB RAM, and same Vega 56 eGPU only over Thunderbolt 1 in Windows 10. It was getting higher FPS on similar settings than my 2018 MBP. I'll have to try playing it a bit in Windows on that older machine to see if that performance holds up while playing on Windows even on such old hardware.

#189 UmarOMC1

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 03:53 AM

Thanks! Here's the output;

BenchmarkResults     2019-11-08_04-44-06
- FramesPerSecondAvg:   63.48
- FrameTimeMsAvg:   15.75

OS: 10.14.6
- Version: 18G1012
GraphicsAPI:     Metal
CPU:     GenericCPUBrand
- PhysicalCores:    6
- LogicalCores:     12
RAM:     65536.00 MB
GPU:     AMD Radeon VII
- VRAM:     16368 / 0 / 0 MB (Dedicated / System / Shared)
- DriverVersion:    AMDRadeonX5000 2.11.21 21406 (Internal: 2.11.21, Unified: 2.11.21)
- DriverDate:   2019-10-24 11:06:41 +0000
ScreenResolution:    2560x1440
RenderResolution:    2560x1440
ScreenPercentage:    100
HDR:     Off

GameUserSettings
- FullscreenMode: WindowedFullscreen
- UseVSync: 0
- PreferredMonitor: XF270HU
- bPrimaryIsPreferredMonitor: 1
- PreferredRefreshRate: 0
- StatsLevel: 0
- FPSLimit: Unlimited
- FPSLimitCustom: 144
- GfxQuality-Override: Undefined
- GfxQuality-Recommended: Low
- GfxQuality: High
- TextureStreaming: Ultra
- MaterialQuality: Medium
- Aniso: SixteenX
- Shadows: Ultra
- DrawDistance: Medium
- EnvironmentDetail: Ultra
- Terrain: Ultra
- Foliage: Ultra
- CharDetail: Ultra
- CAS: 1
- CameraBlur: 0
- ObjectBlur: 0
- AA: Temporal
- VolumetricFog: Medium
- SSR: Medium
- AO: Ultra

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#190 Irishman

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Posted 14 November 2019 - 09:53 AM

View PostJanichsan, on 30 October 2019 - 02:26 PM, said:

Wow. :blink: That was… unexpected.

Neither Feral nor Aspyr mention anything about having ported it. Maybe it's an inhouse port? That would explain the atrocious system requirements.


Yep, it is in-house. I appreciate the effort, Gearbox, but damn, those VRAM requirements! Apparently, somebody there convinced Mr. Pitchford that they could do it.

I guess what I do appreciate is that the macOS version came before the PC players could get theirs through Steam.

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#191 Irishman

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Posted 14 November 2019 - 10:00 AM

View PostUmarOMC1, on 11 November 2019 - 12:15 AM, said:

No, the Borderlands 3 demo run.

Wait a second! There's a demo?
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#192 Matt Diamond

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Posted 14 November 2019 - 07:01 PM

View PostIrishman, on 14 November 2019 - 10:00 AM, said:

Wait a second! There's a demo?
I believe "demo run" was referring to the scene you can run for benchmarking.

Incidentally I no longer trust the video settings to accurately tell me what the current settings are. Here's an easily reproduced bug: turn on the FPS counter and set framerate cap to 30 fps, the counter goes down to 30. Then restart the game, the setting still says 30 but FPS is 60. I have to edit the cap again to have it take effect.

Maybe that's the only example, but a few times I've had it on Low and it looked nice, and other times it looked crappy on Medium, so I'm starting to wonder.
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#193 macdude22

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Posted 14 November 2019 - 08:20 PM

I can confirm the FPS cap does not currently stick on Mac or Windows.
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#194 Matt Diamond

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Posted 15 November 2019 - 06:03 AM

View Postmacdude22, on 14 November 2019 - 08:20 PM, said:

I can confirm the FPS cap does not currently stick on Mac or Windows.
I thought it would be instructive to report such an easily repro'd bug, see what kind of response I get. But there is no place to do so. PC users are posting their bugs to mega-threads hoping the company sees them. :rolleyes:

In happier news: I seem to have licked my problem of the game crapping out after an hour or so. I found a utility that disables turbo boost. The name of the utility is "Disable Turbo Boost". (If you have trouble remembering that I'll try to come up with a mnemonic.)

With game settings quite low and capped to 30 fps I played for over two hours last night, some of it on 1600x900. No problems even during big fights. So it didn't look great but it's much more playable this way- no slide shows or lost audio. I will gradually increase the visual settings, see what I can get away with.

The other thing I did was move the Mini out of its cubby onto my desk, to improve heat dissipation. But I'm sure disabling the boost as what had the most effect.
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#195 UmarOMC1

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Posted 21 November 2019 - 06:07 PM

Game just updated… notice any optimizations?
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#196 Matt Diamond

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Posted 21 November 2019 - 09:28 PM

Downloaded. The Epic downloader (another fine piece of software!) seems to suggest that it only downloaded 20 MB of data. But the game now takes up an extra 2 gig, and bumped from 1.0.3 to 1.0.4.

I keep posting hasty conclusions about this game and then having to modify them later. So I may sit on this for a few days while I form an impression.

Edit: here at least are the release notes: https://borderlands....otfixes-nov-21/
Lots of stability and balance improvements, nothing Mac specific listed. There's actually a link to report problems at the end, I might try to report the FPS cap problem (which I verified is still buggy.)
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#197 Tibur

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Posted 22 November 2019 - 11:25 AM

View PostMatt Diamond, on 21 November 2019 - 09:28 PM, said:

<snip>
I keep posting hasty conclusions about this game and then having to modify them later. So I may sit on this for a few days while I form an impression.

<snip>
Look, here. How do you expect us to produce uninformed opinions and run around like: A) Cassandra or B) Pollyanna if you don't post hasty conclusions about your hate/love for something? :)  This is the internet age for god's sake! I need my outrage/adoration to be instant! Like my artisanal coffee!

#198 UmarOMC1

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Posted 23 November 2019 - 05:45 AM

Perhaps it's a placebo effect but the game chunking when there are a lot of enemies on the screen appears to be gone but it does random, split second frame drops that I suppose might be that DRM thingy mentioned earlier. I was only supposed to play for 20 minutes dag nabbit! I'll try to run the demo again tomorrow.
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#199 Matt Diamond

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Posted 23 November 2019 - 01:28 PM

tl:dr; It's a lot less frustrating to play now.

I am now playing at a higher resolution: 1600x900 and I am leaving CPU turbo boost turned on. My settings are what I call "mostly Medium": Medium defaults with texture streaming = Ultra, shadows = Low, volumetric fog = Off, true reflections = Off. The game looks decent and has been playable, frame rates usually in the low-mid 30s. Most importantly it doesn't CPU throttle after barely an hour like it used to, though I did see it happen after hours of play.

I did get yet another crash while switching levels, but this time the Unreal crash reporter sent the dump to the developers. Also had a weird mouse problem that I hadn't seen since the first day. Just like last time, I fixed it by logged out of OS X.

I submitted a bug report for the FPS Cap setting not taking effect after restarting the game. It will be interesting to see if/when that gets fixed.
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#200 Matt Diamond

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Posted 23 November 2019 - 10:31 PM

... And then I had another of those frustrating sessions where the detail and performance goes to pot after an hour. (Is it particular maps? The types of battles? Unusual activity in the sun's heliosphere? Who knows.)

I still think it is improved a bit, but it is hard to say for sure given how inconsistent it is.
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